Barry H. Obama Wins Nomination!

Beazt · 05-07-2008, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harms

I also doubt the 44% of Hillary voters will vote for Mccain. That is preposterous.

I'm still looking.....haven't found that question found in any recent Gallup Poll.....yet

MTKrav911 · 05-07-2008, 06:31 PM

Here's teh link. Sorry, it's 28%. Still pretty significant. I think you guys will spot me the 18% as a +/-

And to whoever changed my user sig? Thanks. That's flattering.
If McCain vs. Obama, 28% of Clinton Backers Go for McCain

Harms · 05-07-2008, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTKrav911

Here's teh link. Sorry, it's 28%. Still pretty significant. I think you guys will spot me the 18% as a +/-

And to whoever changed my user sig? Thanks. That's flattering.
If McCain vs. Obama, 28% of Clinton Backers Go for McCain

I'll spot you the -18, not the +. I doubt most would carry out voting for Mcain.

MTKrav911 · 05-07-2008, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harms

I'll spot you the -18, not the +. I doubt most would carry out voting for Mcain.

That's the beauty of our system Harms. I will more than likely vote McCain, but am going to listen to the debates and want Obama to convince me why I should change my mind.

I've always been that way about politics. Right now (as of May 7th, 2008), I think McCain is far better a choice than Obama.

However, That's not to say that some debate on October 20th, or Sept 30th, or etc etc, wouldnt sway me

IF...

IF...

Obama comes out with a solid logical argument. I like the guy, I think right now he doesent have anything that convinces me yet.

I'm open minded that way. Not all Republicans are knuckle dragging neo-cons. That's media.

Many of us actually like to see who simply would lead the countryy and not give it away.

GSPALLTHEWAY · 05-07-2008, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTKrav911

Technically right now OBama has it, because you only need 2025 delegates to win and Obama has 1800 with 252 Superdelegates pledged.

This is funny because now it's clear that Hillary has to humble herself to step aside for the inevitable.

Which she won't. Hillary has to do some mega mega evil **** to be able to steal over 400 superdelegates that she'll need to win?

Nothing short of assasination will make that happen. And I do believe someone like her is capable of something like that or having it done.

But....

Looks like Obama is it, which means

McCain wins!

Hillary supporters hate him so much and 44% of them said they will vote McCain if Obama gets the nod.

Plus he has no experience and won't win any debates vs a seasoned ex POW war hero experienced U.S. senator of 24 years.

you are 100% right... i dont like it personally but your right on for sure

BCguy · 05-07-2008, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTKrav911

YEah, but we weren't there prior to 9/11 is the biggest point I'm making. THe threat originated there, now we're there (rightfully or not I'm not arguing that), and we have to stay there until either they change, or we win.

You cant be serious ? What about when the US overthrew the DEMOCRATICALLY elected govt. of Iran and installed the shaw dictator ? Or when the US went over to Afghanistan and gave millions of dollars and weapons to Bin Laden to fight the evil Russian's ? Or when the US was giving weapons and money to both the Iraqis and the Iranaians and basically promoting the the war between them ? You act as if the "terrorists" just started attacking for no reason. I know you lost people on 9/11 and thats sad. And i feel for the families that lost loved ones also. But i also feel for the many Iraqi families losing loved ones to a war being waged on them for an act they had NOTHING to do with (9/11).

MTKrav911 · 05-07-2008, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BCguy

You cant be serious ? What about when the US overthrew the DEMOCRATICALLY elected govt. of Iran and installed the shaw dictator ? Or when the US went over to Afghanistan and gave millions of dollars and weapons to Bin Laden to fight the evil Russian's ? Or when the US was giving weapons and money to both the Iraqis and the Iranaians and basically promoting the the war between them ? You act as if the "terrorists" just started attacking for no reason. I know you lost people on 9/11 and thats sad. And i feel for the families that lost loved ones also. But i also feel for the many Iraqi families losing loved ones to a war being waged on them for an act they had NOTHING to do with (9/11).

Which happened in the Carter Administration (the overthrow of the Shah in Iran), because Cater (a democrat), thought he could muscle OPEC. He couldnt. And lost a leader because of it.

I agree with Afghanistand and Iraq, but the fact is the enemy of my enemy is my friend. This is Warfare 101 train of though. And at the time, Bin Laden was the enemy of our enemy, thus making him o ur friend.....In the 80's.

Bush I and Clinton both are to blame for 9/11.

Bush I because he didnt finish off Saddam who attacked Kuwait. Bin Laden offered his Al Qaeda warriors to fight Saddam, but the Saudi's and Kuwaiti's didnt want him because he was a nut. So the Saudi's and Kuwaiti's went to America. This infuriated Bin Laden who in turn made America Enemy #1.

Then Clinton, for all the aforementioned reasons of his policies int he 90's.

I fault the current Bush for just surrounding himself with idiots. And him acting like one. I applaud him though, that there hasnt been an attack here since 9/11, and through the Patriot Act has made it virtually impossible for one to occur again any time soon.

BCguy · 05-07-2008, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTKrav911

Which happened in the Carter Administration (the overthrow of the Shah in Iran), because Cater (a democrat), thought he could muscle OPEC. He couldnt. And lost a leader because of it.

I agree with Afghanistand and Iraq, but the fact is the enemy of my enemy is my friend. This is Warfare 101 train of though. And at the time, Bin Laden was the enemy of our enemy, thus making him o ur friend.....In the 80's.

Bush I and Clinton both are to blame for 9/11.

Bush I because he didnt finish off Saddam who attacked Kuwait. Bin Laden offered his Al Qaeda warriors to fight Saddam, but the Saudi's and Kuwaiti's didnt want him because he was a nut. So the Saudi's and Kuwaiti's went to America. This infuriated Bin Laden who in turn made America Enemy #1.

Then Clinton, for all the aforementioned reasons of his policies int he 90's.

I fault the current Bush for just surrounding himself with idiots. And him acting like one. I applaud him though, that there hasnt been an attack here since 9/11, and through the Patriot Act has made it virtually impossible for one to occur again any time soon.

Ok , so you claimed that the US was not i the middle east prior to 9/11 , now you agree with me that there has been a US presence there since only .... the 1970 's ? Spin it however you want to , I dont care if they were democrats are republicans. You simply stated that you werent there before 9/11 , now i see you agree with me.

P.S. .... your welcome for your new usertitle.

GSPALLTHEWAY · 05-07-2008, 09:31 PM

and obama wins the dem nomination!!!

MTKrav911 · 05-07-2008, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BCguy

Ok , so you claimed that the US was not i the middle east prior to 9/11 , now you agree with me that there has been a US presence there since only .... the 1970 's ? Spin it however you want to , I dont care if they were democrats are republicans. You simply stated that you werent there before 9/11 , now i see you agree with me.

P.S. .... your welcome for your new usertitle.

Not a physical military force? No.

There were surrogates, which every great nation has used through their spies, surrogate soldiers (meaning soldiers they use from other countries who are sympathetic to democracy, etc.). Other than in Beirut in 1982, which of course got hit and killed 300 Marines? No, not a significant military presence.

But there will be now from now on. The Radicals just couldnt let it go could they? 20 + years of non-retaliation? Now you have a U.S. presence there and now suddenly the U.S. is the bad guy?

Gimme a break.

NOt only do I hope and pray that we build a base there? I hope it rivals only Subic Bay in size in the Phillipines which kept Asia in check for 50 years after World War II

I'd love the U.S. to pull out it's current hardened troops over the next 5 years in Iraq and replace them with well trained fresher troops on levels of 200k plus, to ENSURE, any and all threats by some little bands of terrorists could be quashed rather quickly right there in the middle east.

It won't be easy, but that capability alone is something worth the price in the long run.

That's what McCain is saying.

Unless someone would like to argue the U.S. be pacifist for politics sake, pull out of Iraq completely, make nice and act like nothing ever happened on 9/11 and wait for it to happen again? Oh, and on the way out apologize to all the middle east for the troubles. We didnt mean it. We sympathize with the Radical Jihadist mentality. After all 78% of Americans polled want us out, so we're leaving. Until it happens again, when those 78% will want retaliation. Please. Come do it to us again.

Which is t he Democrats plan.

BCguy · 05-07-2008, 11:04 PM

Krav ..... IRAQ HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH 9/11 !!! ..... Do you not understand that ?

MTKrav911 · 05-07-2008, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BCguy

Krav ..... IRAQ HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH 9/11 !!! ..... Do you not understand that ?

I never said it did. I said why not build a permanent military base in the heart of the Middle East?

There is a good a place as ever. People in that region (the radicals in many cases) launced their attacks of 9/11 from that area. The Mosques, Medrasses, etc, spawned the ideology to attack the Infidel. Only the Infidel is now awake.

So why not build a permanent U.S. presence there?

The sentiment of hatred towards the west by the Middle East pre-dated 9/11. This anti-semitic hatred for Israel, and then subsequently for the U.S. because the two are key strategic and political allies.

This is the true issue. And i welcome it.

The Jihadists and most of the world are wrong on it. They would rather the Holocaust was successful. And IMO, those who oppose Israel, are secretly ones who espouse Hitler's beliefs towareds the Jews.

You win a war, you win a war and are rightful "Occupiers". Now we can argue all day if the Israeli's are right to "expand' that territory, but since nobody is stopping them? At least in Krav's m ind? Why not?

I mean if you don't want someone pissing in your backyard? Why not confront and stop the one doing it?

And that's what all this is about isn't it? The fact that with all the B.S. tactics of Terrorists? No matter how angry you are at Israel and the U.S.?

YOU CANT STOP IT!

Never could, would, or can.

BTW, it's the Palestinans pissing in Israeli's backyard. In all fairness, Israel has been very patient towards the Palestinians.

That won't last forever.

BCguy · 05-07-2008, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTKrav911

I mean if you don't want someone pissing in your backyard? Why not confront and stop the one doing it?

The US has been pissing in a lot of back yards for a long time. This is obviously something we will never agree on cus your stuck in the mentality of "We are always right no matter what we do" "The rest of the world will live like us or they will die" You speak of "breeding out the middle east" , then accuse the muslims of supporting Hitlers ideologies ?

Flying Triangle Choke · 05-08-2008, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTKrav911

I never said it did. I said why not build a permanent military base in the heart of the Middle East?
There is a good a place as ever. People in that region (the radicals in many cases) launced their attacks of 9/11 from that area. The Mosques, Medrasses, etc, spawned the ideology to attack the Infidel. Only the Infidel is now awake.

So why not build a permanent U.S. presence there?

The sentiment of hatred towards the west by the Middle East pre-dated 9/11. This anti-semitic hatred for Israel, and then subsequently for the U.S. because the two are key strategic and political allies.

This is the true issue. And i welcome it.

The Jihadists and most of the world are wrong on it. They would rather the Holocaust was successful. And IMO, those who oppose Israel, are secretly ones who espouse Hitler's beliefs towareds the Jews.

You win a war, you win a war and are rightful "Occupiers". Now we can argue all day if the Israeli's are right to "expand' that territory, but since nobody is stopping them? At least in Krav's m ind? Why not?

I mean if you don't want someone pissing in your backyard? Why not confront and stop the one doing it?

And that's what all this is about isn't it? The fact that with all the B.S. tactics of Terrorists? No matter how angry you are at Israel and the U.S.?

YOU CANT STOP IT!

Never could, would, or can.

BTW, it's the Palestinans pissing in Israeli's backyard. In all fairness, Israel has been very patient towards the Palestinians.

That won't last forever.

That's the whole problem that they have against America. The people in the Middle East don't want any foreign army in their lands, especially a Western army. I think us being in Iraq all these years has been a perfect recruiting tool for militant groups over there. Remember, the people in that part of the world that hate the West have been raised and taught to hate the West and that the Western world can't be trusted. The U.S. army being there gives them the perfect tool to say "see, we told you so!". Also, comparing the "Jihadists" beliefs to Hitler's beliefs seems a tad bit of a stretch, no?

Gooner · 05-08-2008, 03:53 AM

LOL, someone's been busy changing people's user titles.
I like mine personally. I think I know who's behind it too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTKrav911

I never said it did. I said why not build a permanent military base in the heart of the Middle East?

There is a good a place as ever. People in that region (the radicals in many cases) launced their attacks of 9/11 from that area. The Mosques, Medrasses, etc, spawned the ideology to attack the Infidel. Only the Infidel is now awake.

So why not build a permanent U.S. presence there?

The sentiment of hatred towards the west by the Middle East pre-dated 9/11. This anti-semitic hatred for Israel, and then subsequently for the U.S. because the two are key strategic and political allies.

This is the true issue. And i welcome it.

The Jihadists and most of the world are wrong on it. They would rather the Holocaust was successful. And IMO, those who oppose Israel, are secretly ones who espouse Hitler's beliefs towareds the Jews.

You win a war, you win a war and are rightful "Occupiers". Now we can argue all day if the Israeli's are right to "expand' that territory, but since nobody is stopping them? At least in Krav's m ind? Why not?

I mean if you don't want someone pissing in your backyard? Why not confront and stop the one doing it?

And that's what all this is about isn't it? The fact that with all the B.S. tactics of Terrorists? No matter how angry you are at Israel and the U.S.?

YOU CANT STOP IT!

Never could, would, or can.

BTW, it's the Palestinans pissing in Israeli's backyard. In all fairness, Israel has been very patient towards the Palestinians.

That won't last forever.

Let's see, why not build a permanent base there?
-Because it's a sovereign state, they want you out of there, you don't have that right and you really shouldn't?

Ahhh, but winners can do whatever they want... I see.

I wonder if you'll have that same mentality once the US loses its superpower status to China...

The "terrorists" actually can stop the occupation. Just like the Vietnamese did. It's just gonna take a long time, and a lot of dead Americans. Sad but true.

mammoth91 · 05-08-2008, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BCguy

You speak of "breeding out the middle east" , then accuse the muslims of supporting Hitlers ideologies ?

I find this to be very disturbing...

Mickey Finn · 05-09-2008, 12:53 AM

i support mccain. hes intelligent, well spoken but not in a politician type manner, hes easily the most down to earth candidate, was in the military and has been in the senate for over 20 years. i agree that the US shouldnt bail out of iraq and should try to leave at a point when the area is stable. the 100 years comment was actually a joke and taken out of context. i think he has the plans to make that happen and it will be done, especially as the situation in iraq has improved greatly over the last year, which most people dont want to recognise. i also like his policies on immigration and health care. and ive always been an advocate for conservative economics, and he is the best person to implement that

Crashsti · 05-09-2008, 10:31 AM

Terrorism is a real threat, i can't disagree with that. However so are tornados, auto accidents, smoking, alcohol abuse, domestic abuse and suicide. Just look at the recent typhoon in Myanmar, almost 100,000 possible deaths and the US has looked the other way when it came to that government. We even looked the other way when that countries people marched in favor of democracy. Suicide is another worldwide killer, in the US alone there were 420,000 reports of self inflicted injury at ERs in 2005 and almost 33,000 suicides. Why is no one talking about that? its all about terrorism, kill the terrorists, who to invade. In the end violence does nothing more then create more violence and i am sick of it.

mammoth91 · 05-09-2008, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crashsti

Just look at the recent typhoon in Myanmar, almost 100,000 possible deaths and the US has looked the other way when it came to that government. We even looked the other way when that countries people marched in favor of democracy.

Thank you Crash. I posted your quote becasue people need to read it again. Those people were cut down in the streets when they marched for Democracy. Tibet ?? I could go on and on but I can only take so much.. If you support this occupation, fine, you can. Just please do not drop the ' It's for democracy ' line of BS because that just makes you look uninformed and dumb..

I LOVE the quote from Condi when she said that the people in Iraq were taking baby steps towards democracy when they were protesting the U.S. occupation in the streets. That is as funny as it gets..

AikaImmortal · 05-09-2008, 01:20 PM