[Danny]

SALVADOR, Brazil — Antonio Rogerio Nogueira (Pictures) is the newest Brazilian Olympic National Boxing Champion. The PRIDE star tried a new venture in the ring and in his amateur debut conquered the title in the super-heavyweight category last weekend in the 60th edition of the event in which teams from each Brazilian state battle in Olympic boxing weight classes.

Under the watchful eyes of his twin brother Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira (Pictures) and all the fans that were in the audience, “Minotoro” Defended his home state of Bahia, putting on a show in the finals as he outscored Cássio da Silva 26-9.

“It is beautiful to see a heavyweight with a lot of technique and punching in line like Rogério. He has a bright future and can give a lot of happiness to Brazilian boxing,” guarantees his coach Luís Dórea, who also revealed Acelino “Popó” Freitas to the boxing world.

Nogueira was very satisfied with his performance and expects to reach even higher goals.

“I started to practice boxing only to increase my performance in MMA,” said the PRIDE middleweight fighter, “but I adapted myself very well and today I have plans to challenge in the Rio Pan American Games in 2007 and maybe the next Olympic Games.”

That is kind of proof that MMA isn't "sloppy boxing". I believe Jens also competed in boxing after his stint in the UFC. What do you guys think?

I mean, Lil Nog is more of a grappler than a srtiker and he won a huge tourny? I don't watch much boxing, so I'd liek to hear what the boxing posters think?

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lwbfl

I think that all elite athletes have the ability to excel at other ventures just as well. They already know what it takes to be the best, and if they apply themselves can achieve elite status in any venue they choose. How many elite grapplers or in Japan professional wrestlers study Muy Tai and/or boxing and become excellent MMA fighters?

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Unknown

Yeah, MMA isn't sloppy boxing at all. Once you can be taken down the way you throw a punch has to change or you could end up with problems.

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Crashsti

there are quite a few good boxers in MMA. the Nogueira brothers are both very good boxers and Vitor Belfort is also a very good boxer who was at one point supposed to be trying out for the Olympics in boxing representing Brazil. the thing is though that its very difficult to use true boxing in MMA. too many things to take into account like takedowns, kicks and you name it. lots of MMA fighters are Golden Gloves champions as well.

cottonzway

Chris Lytle has done pretty good in boxing as well. 13-1 I think.

angryjonny

There are some sloppy boxers in MMA but it's mainly due to crosstraining maybe? There are some guys who can knock guys out right and left but to a technical boxer their styles might be labeled "sloppy." I also think Murilo Bustamante has very good boxing for being labeled a ground wizard. His jabs are very sharp and has crisp punches. His long reach makes him very good and dangerous because he can work on his feet as well as the ground.

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Brandon_Dicken

I I think he may have won because of mma in mma you have to watch for takedowns kicks knees elbows submissions and all that kind of stuff on a constant basis. In boxing you watch for hands and you got those big golves so its easyier to block and since nog came from MMa I bet he never tired once.

This may be off topic a little but one of my favorite thing with boxing and mma is that when ppl see mma they say "that won't work on the street" but they think boxing will and you see people enroll in boxing course cause they think it'll make them invinceble

fedoramazing

who are you reffering to

Unknown

Well In a street fight you want to stay off the ground just in case someone else trys to get involved. But I have never heard any one say that MMA won't work on the streets.

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Brandon_Dicken

All mma is not on the ground I'm talking about mma and other things like kung fu and karate and taekwondo etc. Most average ppl don't think any of that works. You say you never heard that watch any early mma see what commentators say, you never heard that watch ufc 1 listen to jim brown ask anyone just walking around outside have a little video moniter and have a gracie submiting someone and say do you think that will work in a real fight I bet 50% or more say no it won't.

mepersoner

You're disadvantaged whether you're on your feet or on the ground against multiple opponents.

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Click for why the US invaded Iraq.

lwbfl

Thats what I was thinking. Just ask dirtychuck!

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Unknown

Yeah your at more of a disadvantage when in close combat with them. Submitting two people is a lot harder than knocking out two people. When you are at striking distance you can still punch back. Your best bet is to stay off the ground, pick up something big to use for a weapon to fend them off. Keep some distance. Make sure that all attackers are on one side of you. Defend your friends if you have to. Then head for the exit.

But back to boxing, I have never heard anyone come in to train so that they can be invinceble. People who are looking for something to make them invinceble usually go train in Karate or some other traditional martial art. Most people who come to train at my gym actually think that boxing wouldn't be effective in the streets and just come to do it as a sport. The biggest reason I have heard is because they can't kick. (all those Jackie Chan movies have lead a lot of people to believe that is the most effective street defense).

Brandon, anyone who has told you that MMA is just sloppy boxing or that it wont work on the streets has no idea at all what they are talking about. With some slight changes to a boxers stance, how he defends a punch, and when he throws a punch he can become a good striker in MMA, and with the same changes in reverse a MMA fighter can become a good boxer.

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Brandon_Dicken

You mix an twist everything ytou miss the whole point of 99% of my post you say you never heard anyone say that or seen a boxer that thinks he the most dangerous man in the world. Anyone else can relate but not you you never heard anyone say mma really doesn't work and boxing doesn't work in mma that well in needs to be completely readjusted to be effective. I didn't say anyhting about sloppy boxing I was comparing people who think boxers can ko everyone.

Unknown

Well the sloppy boxing argument is the only argument I have ever heard against MMA. (it was not brought up in street fight context) And I have never met a boxer that says they are the most dangerous person in the world. I have met people who have never heard of MMA and studied Karate or some form of Kung Fu that did think that they were the most dangerous person in the world.

And boxing will work in MMA, it takes very small changes in style.

Also the biggest thing that would make most people think that a submission won't work on the street is because someone else can jump in and stomp you. Plus lets say you get a choke and the guy passes out. You then what let go and just as you get away he gets up and comes back after you, or you hold it and either cause brain damage or kill him and then your a murderer. Or you get an armbar and break his arm, then you get up go to walk away but he can still punch with the other arm and now he is pissed now all you can do is hope he wont pull a forest griffen on you and knock you out with his other arm. Then what? Thats also why some people think that won't work on a street. Your number 1 goal in a street fight is to prevent harm to yourself, your frinds and your faimly and get yourself out of the situation, BJJ complicates both parts. Not saying that it isn't effective in dealing out damage but it puts you at risk and makes it harder for you to escape the situation. If damage against one opponet without using a weapon is your goal then BJJ would be your best bet.

As for people who think boxers can KO everyone, I have never met anyone who thinks that way.

And if I twist everything around it's because I sometime have trouble following what you say because of your lack of periods to seperate thougths. So if I have missed anything feel free to explain to me what you are trying to say.

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lwbfl

I've been using BJJ in a prison setting (and caught an inmate making money fighting using BJJ) and it's worked for me. It's alot better than breaking my hand on a hard head like before.

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Unknown

It's a little different in a prison because the object there for a corrections officer is to restrain not to escape. I am assuming that you mean you used the position aspects of BJJ as opposed to submissions because I doubt that everyone would be happy if you broke an inmates arm.

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Brandon_Dicken

What was mike tyson used to all ways say "I'm the baddest man on the planet" You never heard this you never heard that what ever your just makin arguements. BJJ won't work in a street fight WHAT! if you have some on in a choke why would you let go yopu say fear of killing the guy well how is koing him any better or pounding his head gonna be safer. Or if you break his arm he'll use the other yeah OK! they'll be screaming about that arm so much they won't be able to get up. Street fight is a fight to the death in the terms that the person your fighting has no intention of letting you live the are really trying to hurt you. I that situation do what you do best don't just say stand up is better.

You make boxers out to be the nicest guys out there with no competetive bone in them. Boxers and wrestlers have the biggest fight ego and so do larger ppl. Here's unkowns response "Well I never heard that all the kung fu guys try to fight the boxers"

Unknown

Considering that mike Tyson is before my time I haven’t heard him say that. And when I refer to 'Kung fu guys' I refer to the people who have just went and had a few classes and suddenly think that they can beat up anyone not someone who has been doing it for their entire life. Believe me there are a lot more of those then there boxers. One of the first things you learn in a boxing match is that you are not invincible. You don't really learn that in the self defense programs out there.

Knocking someone out last longer than choking someone out. I have done both. And you would be surprised how little pain you feel if you break a bone when your adrenalin is pumping. And one more thing think about what would happen if you putting an arm bar on someone with a knife in their hand. When standing up you can use (as Bas puts it) "ambiance" and you can keep your distance from the opponent incase they do have a knife in their hand. Believe me there are a lot more risks going to the ground in a street fight than there are rewards.

But my argument isn't really against BJJ it's against street fighting. Boxing isn't perfect for street fighting either but it just makes it easier to get out of it. And in a competition the BJJ fighter has an advantage (unless the boxer can sprawl). But street fighting is no rules and can involve weapons. And once you add weapons, all of the skills in MMA become useless.

By the way my father (a corrections officer) deals with all kinds of people every day who were in a street fight to the DEATH. And if you do that then you have lost too. But do what you want Brandon, I am sure that bubba can take care of you.

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Brandon_Dicken

You say they don't teach disipline with in kung fu and karate and stuff like that yeah sure. You say a KO from a punch will last longer than being choked out, Tell me how is that. There it is "Mike tyson was before my time I never heard that" Here the only guy in the world who has never met an arogant boxer. You say bjj won't work if they got a knife well try punching him he has a knife see what happens. Why do the army, cops and others ppl who do enforcement teach their ppl bjj and not boxing. and yet agian you twisted my words to the death meaning the gy who pulled a knife isn't going to cut your arm and say had enough buddy I don't know if thats how you guys fight were you come from or maybe you just never heard of someone trying to kill someone in a fight on the street.