BJJ overated these days?

Crashsti · 12-26-2005, 11:08 AM

is BJJ overrated as a fighting art in MMA these days? it seems a long time since a BJJ guy has shown any dominance in the sport. the Gracie's are hardly on the map anymore and the rules of the UFC and Pride no longer give an advantage to BJJ fighters. i read in several magazines that BJJ is gradually being lumped into the same category as "traditional" martial arts as opposed to being the art that it was during the early days of the UFC. what does everyone think? i personally think that when BJJ was new it was hard to defend against but know it is not new and people really know how to stuff submissions.

DrumzCT · 12-26-2005, 11:47 AM

Well knowing how to defend the submission is as much a part of BJJ as being able to perform the submission. I think the thing that sets it apart from traditional MA is the way it is trained. It's more "coached" like a sport would be than traditional MA.

It is also %100 practical. Most other MA like Tae Kwan Do have certain techniques that are barely ever used in sparring or self defense.

I think BJJ will always be a must in MMA as long as there are submissions.

lwbfl · 12-26-2005, 02:02 PM

There are three main elements in MMA. Striking, grappling, submissions. BJJ has some of the same techniques as all grappling and submission fighting systems. All of the top fighters in MMA venues have grappling and submission skills. Now as for fighters that only use BJJ, yes, thats past, but BJJ is still a very prevelant part of the MMA fighters arsenal.

[Danny] · 12-26-2005, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrumzCT

It is also %100 practical. Most other MA like Tae Kwan Do have certain techniques that are barely ever used in sparring or self defense.

But at the same time about 95% of Taekwondo is practical, a lot of the fighters today have backgrounds and cross train with Taekwondo, as if they did in Boxing or Muay Thai.

Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is a must in MMA as is Judo and Wrestling. The ground game is still a huge part of MMa and in my opinion a perfect 50% of it.

Karhopper85 · 12-26-2005, 05:15 PM

overrated have you seen shaolin ribero in action. hes the bomb. i bet with the way his bjj flows he coould even put a a threat to gomi

DrumzCT · 12-26-2005, 06:52 PM

Quote:

But at the same time about 95% of Taekwondo is practical, a lot of the fighters today have backgrounds and cross train with Taekwondo, as if they did in Boxing or Muay Thai.

I did Tae Kwan Do for 4 years and the only things I still use are the side kick (with or without spin), spinning back kick and roundhouse kick. Tae Kwan Do does have the "reverse punch" but the school I trained at had very little focus on how to set up a good over hand right and, in my opinion, the main thing that makes traditional MA pale so much in comparison to boxing when it comes to hands is the lack of the jab.

That may just be a reflection on the school I went to though.

[Danny] · 12-27-2005, 02:46 AM

The leg kick, the bodochagi (sp?), spinning backfist, the boxing involved in Taekwondo, etc. You did ITF correct? Well, that is taught to be non contact sparring (sport-karate).

WTF, the more popular olympic style sparring, is full contact fighting a lot like kickboxing with the focus more on the legs than knees and hands.

Here is a practitioner of WTF in a K-1 MAX event I believe:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...2355459&q=thai

The guy needs to hone his hands to be a decent fighter. Although "flashy" those kicks are damn effective in MMA. Mirko Crocop said in a interview that his kicks wouldn't be as strong as they are today if it wasn't for his taekwondo training in the past and crosstraining today. David Loiseau is a 3rd Dan blackbelt and uses a lot of it, including the elbows, in his MMA fights.

I'm just saying, all full contact arts that have a legitamate backing (Taekwondo/Olympics, BJJ/ADCC, Kickboxing/K-1, Judo/Olympics) are effective in MMA if applied correctly.

DrumzCT · 12-29-2005, 07:56 AM

I absolutely agree with you.

Quote:

I'm just saying, all full contact arts that have a legitamate backing

Where I trained it was not full contact at all. I firmly believe that any art, when trained full contact, under stress and such is effective in MMA or for self defense. I don't care how obscure the art, it's all about how you train it. I definitely wouldn'y have a nasty right leg round house myself if it weren't for TKD.

Unknown · 12-29-2005, 07:21 PM

I think the biggest reason that BJJ isn't being seen as much these days is because of the wrestling and position skills of most other fighters. I personaly think that Wrestling is one of the most important skills you can have in MMA because the better wrestler/control fighter usually dictates where the fight takes place. And a really good wrestler can keep the other guy from doing anything at all. But you still have to know BJJ or stand-up to do something with the position you get. I think that BJJ is still a very popular thing to train, but I don't think that their are going to be as many fighters comming from BJJ and moving into MMA afterwards as their are from other martial arts. Besides most people who would be interested in BJJ these days are looking to training for MMA so they train in everything else as well. But there is still alot of interest in other martial arts by themselves.

As for other martial arts. Most martial arts will do you good if you train very hard in them. On the amature level the number 1 weapon anyone can have is conditioning. But after that some things work and others don't. Their is alot of BJJ that isn't really effective when the person can hit you on the ground. The Martial arts you see in action alot were refinded from years of competition by people who wanted to fight. The other martial arts were used more as self defence and for forms.

Most of the 'traditional' martial arts use open wide stances to get power for a punch. These days the more effective martial arts use the boxing style punches which involve generating power from the waist and hips. It's not quite as powerful but you are alot more mobile and adaptiable. And harder to counter.

You still see fighters adopt a wide stance to hammer away when their opponent is hurt. And that is the case with some other techniques like spinning back fists. There are some times in a fight where using one of the traditional martial arts strikes would be more effecitve than just a punch. But for the most part the standard stuff is better to train in. There will be more times where it will be usefull.

cottonzway · 01-04-2006, 06:42 PM

Everyone does some forum of Jiu-Jitsu. It's a staple of MMA. That doesn't mean it has to be your base as a grappler, but look at some of the people who dominate at other various grappling arts and they take it. From world class judokas to world class greco wrestlers.

Using pure BJJ though is done. You can't just do one thing. This goes for any single martial arts. That's why it's called mixed martial arts.