Vitor/Natsula test positive

Crashsti · 10-30-2006, 12:40 PM

i don't think the UFC really has to say a word about the positive steroid tests in Pride. its really bad for the sport as a whole, both Pride and the UFC. the UFC however has gone along with the NSAC since it was bought by the Fertitta's and have taken a strong stance against drug use. Pride on the other hand does'nt address the issue, at least in Japan, in the USA they now have to and it could be a big problem in the future.

angryjonny · 10-30-2006, 04:53 PM

MTKrav it's funny how you talk about steroids like the UFC has never had issues with them. If they attacked Pride for 2 of their fighters testing positive that would be the dumbest claim ever. Especially with the UFC only testing what 5 fighters at most per event?

AikaImmortal · 10-30-2006, 07:29 PM

With a former NSAC head in the Zuffa company now.. it makes hiding failed UAs much easier one would think.

Crashsti · 11-02-2006, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AikaImmortal

With a former NSAC head in the Zuffa company now.. it makes hiding failed UAs much easier one would think.

i don't think the UFC has to hide anything. its in thier best interests to "expose" everyone who is using banned substances. it keeps them out of the territory that baseball has strayed into with thier limited desire to test its own athletes. the UFC retains a clean image while the full blame for using is put on the fighter.

angryjonny · 11-02-2006, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crashsti

i don't think the UFC has to hide anything. its in thier best interests to "expose" everyone who is using banned substances. it keeps them out of the territory that baseball has strayed into with thier limited desire to test its own athletes. the UFC retains a clean image while the full blame for using is put on the fighter.

I really don't think it's in their best interest. What they do is good enough for them to not make themselves look bad yet still give people the impression that all the fighters are clean, and a lot of people go for it so they are doing something right.

Crashsti · 11-02-2006, 09:40 AM

alot of sports have been plagued by various doping scandals. Cycling, baseball, track and field to name a few. the UFC and mma in general already suffer from a poor "public" image. by "public" i mean the way the story hungry media likes to portray it. anything they can do to clean up that image is welcome in my opinion. even limited drug testing proves that the UFC is addressing the steroids issue. while it does'nt prove that any athlete is clean it gives the UFC protection from liability.

angryjonny · 11-02-2006, 10:11 AM

Right. But what I mean is most of the people who are out to give MMA, or "Ultimate fighting" as it's known in the media, a bad name don't know that the steroid testing is a joke. All they know is what Dana tells them and all he has to say is that the fighters are tested and that's all they have to go with. So even the casual fan thinks that it's clean as well. So as I said before I think they way they have it now is fine, in terms of public image. That old saying "if it ain't broke don't fix it" applies.

Now my opinion of it is much different. I would like to see all the fighters be blood tested just to see how clean MMA really is. Just to make people realize how broad steroid usage is. But this also makes me wonder if all the fighters really stopped using would some of the really exciting top fighters performances or just quality of fights in general go down?

Crashsti · 11-02-2006, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angryjonny

Right. But what I mean is most of the people who are out to give MMA, or "Ultimate fighting" as it's known in the media, a bad name don't know that the steroid testing is a joke. All they know is what Dana tells them and all he has to say is that the fighters are tested and that's all they have to go with. So even the casual fan thinks that it's clean as well. So as I said before I think they way they have it now is fine, in terms of public image. That old saying "if it ain't broke don't fix it" applies.

Now my opinion of it is much different. I would like to see all the fighters be blood tested just to see how clean MMA really is. Just to make people realize how broad steroid usage is. But this also makes me wonder if all the fighters really stopped using would some of the really exciting top fighters performances or just quality of fights in general go down?

i have always though that the UFC and the NSAC should do unannounced drug testing like is done in professional cycling. this way a fighter could be tested at anytime and we'd really find out who is clean and who is'nt. no more using steroids and then coming off them just in time to pass a post fight piss test. as for in cage performance? i think it would still be as exciting if not more so. you would forever end the debate about who is juicing and who is'nt.

Jras0001 · 11-10-2006, 06:14 PM

As much as I want to give Vitor the benifit of the doubt, it is hard to do so with so many people testing positive these days. This is his response to the steroid allegations. If its true, then I feel bad for him having to go through this. If it isnt, then he should get what anyone else gets that uses a banned substance.

http://66.232.103.80/absolutenm/temp...2916&zoneid=13

Crashsti · 11-13-2006, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jras0001

As much as I want to give Vitor the benifit of the doubt, it is hard to do so with so many people testing positive these days. This is his response to the steroid allegations. If its true, then I feel bad for him having to go through this. If it isnt, then he should get what anyone else gets that uses a banned substance.

http://66.232.103.80/absolutenm/temp...2916&zoneid=13

this is very similar to what Bonnar claims on his website, that he did'nt take a steroid but he took a dietary supplement that contained a substance that appears in a piss test like steroids. its a very gray area that is'nt regulated by the food and drug administration since supplements are not considered a food or a drug. manufacturers can make no legal claims to what they product is going to do.

Dirty Fighter · 11-13-2006, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTKrav911

The UFC fighters have been caught, but can't compared to Japan where there are no rules.

The UFC Fighters HAVE TO STOP otherwise they dont fight. PERIOD!

The NSAC makes sure of that, that's why they caught Belfort AFTER the fight that he lost.

Pride has to understand one thing here. To be ATHLETICALLY SANCTIONED IN THE US.......YOu'd better be clean! That means real doctors with real medical degrees working for real state athletic commisions. That's why craziness doesent happen medically compared to overseas.

There is no "Misunderstanding about it." If youre a UFC fighter and are screened in the BIGGEST VENUE ON EARTH ......i.e. VEGAS!!!!!!

I hate to break the news to Pride Fans........

YOU MESSED UP YOUR VEGAS DEBUT WITH THIS!

UFC fighters already know you can't juice!!!!!!

The UFC will own Pride inside of 4 years! Pride in its current economic model can't succeed!

If this were true then just about every professional sport would have been finished long ago, along with alot of amateur sports. A positive test reflects badly on the fighter, not the organization they fight for. That's like saying that if Bonds tests positive for steriods the Giants get kicked out of the major leagues.

AikaImmortal · 11-13-2006, 01:40 PM

The difference between Bonnar and Vitor is simple.. Vitor tested positive for a banned substance that was until recently readily avalible and legal across the USA, so his argument has claim. Bonnar on the other hand tested positive for Equipoise, a HORSE steroid not even schedualed for human use, OTC or prescription, so his argument is laughable at best.

Jras0001 · 11-14-2006, 03:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AikaImmortal

The difference between Bonnar and Vitor is simple.. Vitor tested positive for a banned substance that was until recently readily avalible and legal across the USA, so his argument has claim. Bonnar on the other hand tested positive for Equipoise, a HORSE steroid not even schedualed for human use, OTC or prescription, so his argument is laughable at best.

Thats what I was thinking as well. While in the Army, I used a lot of suplements and what not and I remember one in particular. It was a chewable tablet that came in fruit flavors and was precursors to testosterone. I bought a bottle to try and it gave good results. This was in or around Aug of '03. By the time I went to get another bottle in mid to late Oct, it had already been removed from store shelves (GNC) and I was told that it was now illegal to purchase due to new legislation that had just been signed.

I think that there is a chance that Vitor is telling the truth. I could see a store putting what little they had left of a product on the shelves so they wouldnt take a hit on it financially and then if caught, just playing dumb. Im not gullible enough to think that theres no way that Vitor juiced but Im willing to give him the benifit of the doubt.

AikaImmortal · 11-14-2006, 08:44 AM

Oh man, I remember those.. blame the uninformed Senate. If they knew anything, they would have went after HGH more, and legal prohormones less.

http://www.theorator.com/bills108/hr3866.html

OGIE · 11-14-2006, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AikaImmortal

I don't really know too much about 4-hydroxytestosterone, but it was at one point OTC.

As for Deca (nadrolone), it only has a half life of 6 days.. Pawel, if you are going to cycle, don't do it a week before the fight!

Nandrolone is the most commonly caught steroid bar none. It stays in the system for a rediculously long amount of time. The half life is more dependent on the ester that the steroid is bound to. Any chance of being tested would have to make it the last choice.

The huge benefit of Nandrolone is it ability to lubricate the joints. It would definitely help with those aches and pains incured from training and general abuse of the body. Most guys would add it to a cycle just to help in that aspect alone.

Not knockin' yah just adding a little light.

AikaImmortal · 11-14-2006, 01:19 PM

Glad to know that information.. I always had heard that the main benifit to deca was the fact that it does not break down to DHT, and less liver toxicity. Didnt know about the binding reflecting more on the half life though!