Pride better w/o head kicks while down? - Fight Forum - MMA - UFC - Boxing - K1

LuvMyCRX® · 08-02-2005, 11:01 PM

Im just getting my first tastes of Pride (Ive seen a few highlight shows and Bushido 8) and it looks so awesome! Im having the worst time getting used to the guys outside the ring who hold in the fighters. Does this distract anyone else? My worst prob is with the head kicks to downed opponents. That seems so cowardly to me. Why would they sanction a move, that seems pretty cheap, with such high risk of major injury?

AikaImmortal · 08-02-2005, 11:15 PM

I have always felt that way LuvMyCRX, I think it would be better without head kicks while down, and with the addition of 4 point striking (aka elbows would be legal).. that could just be our western MMA upbrining, who knows, maybe its a cultural thing?

guile · 08-02-2005, 11:28 PM

I agree that head kicks to downed opponents are extremely violent...I would not allow them if it were up to me. There are several people on here who prefer Pride rules and will strongly disagree.

LastExit34 · 08-02-2005, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guile

I agree that head kicks to downed opponents are extremely violent...I would not allow them if it were up to me. There are several people on here who prefer Pride rules and will strongly disagree.

I would be one of those people that guile is talking about.

But I won't strongly disagree as I'm not really looking for an argument here. I just think that kicks to a downed opponent are as much a part of the sport as punches to a down opponent or kicks to a standing opponent. There isn't much you can do to a guy who is in the butt scoot position if you can't kick him. Especially if he is skilled on the ground, you certainly don't want to just step into his guard. Kicking his legs doesn't really do a ton of damage and doesn't really make for an exciting fight. People seem to dislike kicks and stomps on the ground because they look "brutal." But I have seen punches on the ground look just as brutal. Look at Koscheck vs Sanford from last night. He took 5 or 6 unanswered blows to the face when he was already unconcious. To me it's all part of the sport. I understand that we needs rules to ensure fighter safety, but I don't want to see it come to the point where a fighter can't do anything to attack froma certain position. At the end, it's still a competition of who the best fighter is. And kicking is a part of fighting.

guile · 08-03-2005, 12:38 AM

I suppose...I still think kicks are much more violent than punches. All I know is that you can Kick a football alot further than you could punch it.

Most of the kicks are fine, but I just think you leave alot more potential for serious injury by allowing kicks to the head, especially when the guy on the bottom is KO'd and not defending.

Speaking of KO'd and not defending, the Ref should have been on top of that Koshcheck fight. That was 4 or 5 hits after the first 1 KO'd the guy.

Billdolfski · 08-03-2005, 01:01 AM

I have no idea if this is why but i always kinda figured the eblow thing was to avoid cuts, since they can end fights prematurely.

[Danny] · 08-03-2005, 01:03 AM

I think that head kicks to the ground are ok until somebody actually gets really hurt from them. You can get away from it because you're not pinned against a cage. I just get pissed when a ref misses a fighter's (Silva) hand on the ropes during a stomp. I also think it's a great way to be offensive when a fighter is on their back. You don't have to shoot right into the guard but you can jump and try to land a ax kick.

Brandon_Dicken · 08-03-2005, 01:42 AM

hitting someone on the ground is hitting someone on the ground this MMA the fight doesn't stop until the Ref calls it I don't understand howis different to a forearm in UFC and talking about kick on the ground being a cheap move how cheap is useing a cage to hold the fighter still so you can hit them. I think they should allow both kicks and forearms in each and standing elbows in Pride. I also think the forearm is more dangerous I've never seen someone get soccer kicked and get knocked out maybe stomped but not soccer kicked and they can't stomp or kick the back of the head.

As for UFC yo can through forearms to the back of the head and I've seen fighter get hit with forearms after the KO. Well overall its fighting so its dangerous I don't know what the hell cheap fighting is people say kicking is gay and weak but check out CroCop go ahead and tell him kicks are gay or people say grappling is gay and they should fight with there hands ok tell that to Gracie. boxers

Well I went off subject I think I was gonna go further but stopped

BronxBomber · 08-03-2005, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuvMyCRX

Im just getting my first tastes of Pride (Ive seen a few highlight shows and Bushido 8) and it looks so awesome! Im having the worst time getting used to the guys outside the ring who hold in the fighters. Does this distract anyone else? My worst prob is with the head kicks to downed opponents. That seems so cowardly to me. Why would they sanction a move, that seems pretty cheap, with such high risk of major injury?

#1 ITS JAPAN
#2 ITS ALWAYS BEEN PART OF THE SPORT EVEN IN EARLY TO MID UFC DAYS
#3 WHY NOTTTTT !! IS A UPPERCUT BY TYSON, LIDDELL, OR CROCOP ANY WORSE ..

GO YANKEEEESSSS

guile · 08-03-2005, 02:00 AM

GO CAPSLOCKKKK....You can come back when you agree not to use caps except to start a sentance or fighters name, and you act like less of an ass. Hmm, that might be never.

mepersoner · 08-03-2005, 04:08 AM

No, I actually prefer those. I actually think the UFC is starting to get too many rules nowadays. I have no problems with less rules especially when the ref can call the match anytime.

LuvMyCRX® · 08-03-2005, 08:39 AM

I think if a fighter isnt interested in a more conventional GNP or subs, he would be more 'hardcore' (not exactly the word I wanted, but my vocab pool is shallow right now) to step off, and give him the "get up b*tch" hand wave, and continue with a toe 2 toe game. Maybe fighting like a man is different in Japan.

SeikanJudanski · 08-03-2005, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuvMyCRX

Maybe fighting like a man is different in Japan.

Now now.. no need to start going overboard. I think it would be better just to say you don´t agree with stomps, instead of trying to offend the pride and honor of a whole nation. A statement like that means, they fight like cowards in Japan.. so I guess all the fighters in Japan are cowards? come on CRX..

[Danny] · 08-03-2005, 09:26 AM

CRX that is a total sterotype. If you don't like Pride rules, don't watch the promotion than. But, you'll be missing out on the biggest promotion in MMA.

LuvMyCRX® · 08-03-2005, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeikanJudanski

Now now.. no need to start going overboard. I think it would be better just to say you don´t agree with stomps, instead of trying to offend the pride and honor of a whole nation. A statement like that means, they fight like cowards in Japan.. so I guess all the fighters in Japan are cowards? come on CRX..

I wasnt trying to bash anyone, I was just speculating if their perception of what makes a fair fight is different. Kamikaze pilots seem like madness to us, and an honorable deathj to them. Its just diff strokes for diff folks.

[Danny] · 08-03-2005, 09:33 AM

Well, if you take away stomps, certain aspects of Gnp, etc. what do you have? Really crappy boxing.

DrumzCT · 08-03-2005, 09:47 AM

I can go either way with the downed head kicks.

That's how Fajita took out Bob Sapp. (I think he tapped from punches but those brutal kicks did alot of damage) I don't see a reason to change the rules but I don't enjoy watching some guy get kicked in the head repeatedly. I can go to a bar and watch that.

mepersoner · 08-03-2005, 04:55 PM

What you guys fail to realize is if the guy is getting real hurt or is in real danger because he's not defending for whatever reason, the ref will stop the fight. Just like in the UFC. When you stop letting the fighter and his corner decide when the fight ends and start letting the ref decide, there is a lot less chance of injury (because fighters often have a never say die mentality).

DrumzCT · 08-03-2005, 05:05 PM

Quote:

What you guys fail to realize is if the guy is getting real hurt or is in real danger because he's not defending for whatever reason, the ref will stop the fight. Just like in the UFC. When you stop letting the fighter and his corner decide when the fight ends and start letting the ref decide, there is a lot less chance of injury (because fighters often have a never say die mentality).

Very true. I'm sure we all agree that MMA is a sport. A sport is any competitive activity which involves skill.

I believe that kicking someone in the head on the ground doesn't show the skill that these fighters have and takes the fight to a level of grade school schoolyard fights.

Just my opinion.

Bellyflip · 08-04-2005, 05:23 PM

I didn't read all the posts here but I'll throw my opinion out there anyways. Soccer kicks and stomps are fine by me as long as it's in a ring. If you allow it in a cage and a fighter is pinned against the fence he could be seriously injured or killed. The thing I have trouble understanding is that Pride allows soccer kicks, stomps and knees to the head of a downed opponent but not elbows. Can anyone think of a logical explanation to this?