Michael Richards (Seinfeld's Kramer) outburst and appology

MuStAnG12687 · 11-21-2006, 12:06 PM

Michael Richards slews racist remarks at a comedy club...what do you guys think about this and his apology?

Outburst:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=-T7uKvpzVXI

Apology on David Letterman last night:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=o5eZqtb1hZw

I loved Michael Richards character in Seinfeld...but this was uncalled for...

Crashsti · 11-21-2006, 01:39 PM

well, looks like Mel Gibson is off the hook for awhile. why would he choose to go that route with his comedy? i did'nt find it amusing and i am not even sure what he was talking about, part of that has to do with not hearing more prior to the racist outburts, but just the same. there is comedy and then there are people who are just offensive looking to get a reaction. some comics can combine the two, others can't. as for the apology. kinda weak, he did'nt take responsiblity for the situation, he blamed it on the hecklers who in my opinion were not hecklers but were only speaking up for thier rights. comics have the right to walk on the edge but need to know when they are crossing that line, Micheal Richard's crossed that line and kept going. hate is not funny even when disguised as comedy.

angryjonny · 11-21-2006, 01:51 PM

Not trying to defend it Crashti but to clarify that wasn't part of his act. They just showed his outburst against the people who were heckling him.

Jras0001 · 11-21-2006, 01:59 PM

I dont think that outburst necessarily makes him a "racist". I believe there is a difference between saying or making a racist comment and actually being a racist. It looked like he was mad, pissed off, and trying to say something that would really anger or hurt the people he was directing his anger at. Everyone in America knows that one sure and proven way to get under the skin and anger an African American is to start tossing the "N" word around and thats what he did. Unless he has shown a pattern of such behavior in the past, which I dont believe he has, then its hard to come out and say hes a racist over whats shown on the video clip.

As for his apology, it seems legit. He looks and acts like a guy thats mortified over his own behavior. If anyone has seen other interviews with him, thats not how he acts in an interview normily.

I hope that he can get past this and work out his issues and get back to doing comedy. Id hate to see something like this end a career.

AND....not that Im saying it justifies what he did, BUT he wasnt the only person throwing racist remarks around in that video. It seems like its ok for white people to be the targets of racial slurrs in public or on tv and things such as that and no one says much. But when the tables are turned, we all see how fast the media jumps on it especially when its a famous person that is involved.

Ive actually been told to my face by a black person that since I wasnt black, theres no way I could have any idea about or know anything about racism and how it affects people. I was standing with four other guys at the time this was being told to us and two of them happened to be Jewish...Im sure they are just as "clueless" as I am.....

Crashsti · 11-21-2006, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angryjonny

Not trying to defend it Crashti but to clarify that wasn't part of his act. They just showed his outburst against the people who were heckling him.

thats what i mean, i could'nt tell where his act ended and the outburst began. however this is an example of being the better man. so what if he was heckled, if that was the worst thing that happened to him he's not doing so bad. he could have controlled his behavior then and avoided all of the aftermath. instead he will be forever dealing out apologies and his character is tainted. personally i would think a comedian could be alittle more creative then to resort to racial slurs. you can offend people without having to go that route.

Goeth27 · 11-21-2006, 02:19 PM

I actually think its racist to not let white people say certain words.

angryjonny · 11-21-2006, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crashsti

thats what i mean, i could'nt tell where his act ended and the outburst began. however this is an example of being the better man. so what if he was heckled, if that was the worst thing that happened to him he's not doing so bad. he could have controlled his behavior then and avoided all of the aftermath. instead he will be forever dealing out apologies and his character is tainted. personally i would think a comedian could be alittle more creative then to resort to racial slurs. you can offend people without having to go that route.

I totally agree he should have controlled himself. Like jras mentioned he seemed to be just grabbing the first thing that he knew was the most awful thing you could say to a black man just because he was upset, which shows by the lack of creativity, he just said it over and over because he knew it would strike a nerve in a big way. It was very stupid of him to do that but what did the black guy do? He threw a racial slur right back at him. So is that one justified only because Michael did it first? Where is the black man's apology? Does only Richards have to apologize because he is a celebrity, and the other man is okay to say offensive things to Richards? Is it okay for black people to use racial slurs and not vice versa? They are both at fault and neither should be acceptable.

Michael is human just like everyone else. It was a horrible thing to do and his apology did seem genuine. He really seemed ashamed by what he said. Unfortunately like you said he probably tainted his character and some people will never forgive him.

Crashsti · 11-21-2006, 02:42 PM

i am going to share something here. i had my own experience with racism and it made me take a real hard look at my own character. i had just gotten out of work and its 6am, still dark and very cold. a coworker and i are approached by two visibly intoxicated black men. they claimed to have been walking for quite sometime and were getting cold and wanted to make a phone call to try to get a ride, but needed some change to make the call. i gave the man a few coins and he made his call. a few moments later he came over asking if i could give him a ride. he was very persistant and i was rather annoyed by it. i told him no several times, that i was'nt going in that direction, which i was'nt. he then told me that i would'nt give him a ride because he was black. i was a bit taken back by this. he then told me he was'nt going to steal my car or shoot me and told me i could check him for guns if i wanted to. i finally caved in and gave the guy a ride. i was very agitated at this point and my driving was less then casual. i have a 300horsepower car and i let him know it. the man told me to not be so crazy and to relax. he then told me that he was worried that someone like myself, the white country boy, was going to tie the black man up and leave him in the woods to die. he turned out to be from Philly and was in the area visiting his girlfriend and was OK. he had never been in a small town before that was predominately white. so he was a bit frightened himself. we had a brief conversation and i explained to him that we just don't have any black people in the area. that i did'nt even meet a black person until i was in high school and he was an exchange student from Africa. it was an eye opening experience. it showed my that while i did'nt feel racist, i actually was on the inside whether i liked it or not. part of my upbringing? i can't say, but ever since i have tried to ve very openminded and not simply judge people by the color of the skin.

angryjonny · 11-21-2006, 02:56 PM

I believe that everyone can be prejudice at times. Whether they know it or not. I've actually done a report about it in my Comp and Reading class. And they don't do it to offend either. They just take in how people are stereotyped and when they do get in a situation similar to yours they do think things that normally they would say they are totally against. I hear people say all the time that they would never do this and that. Sure they don't have the natural thought process about it, it just happens. I've done it before when I've taken a wrong turn and ended up in a "bad part of town" or whatever.

I know it's totally different from what Richards did, since he did it to try and hurt someone else, but I just see it as the old "throwing stones in glass houses" thing. This particular instance just makes me mad, not just because of what Richards did but that the black man is excused from his actions and is made out to be the victim. He would have been if he stopped at the "that was uncalled for" even insulting his career wasn't a big deal either but the black man went too far as well.

Crashsti · 11-21-2006, 02:59 PM

an eye for an eye. or to quote the great Dumbledorf from Harry Potter. "we must choose between what is right and what is easy."

MuStAnG12687 · 11-21-2006, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jras0001

I dont think that outburst necessarily makes him a "racist". I believe there is a difference between saying or making a racist comment and actually being a racist. It looked like he was mad, pissed off, and trying to say something that would really anger or hurt the people he was directing his anger at. Everyone in America knows that one sure and proven way to get under the skin and anger an African American is to start tossing the "N" word around and thats what he did. Unless he has shown a pattern of such behavior in the past, which I dont believe he has, then its hard to come out and say hes a racist over whats shown on the video clip.

As for his apology, it seems legit. He looks and acts like a guy thats mortified over his own behavior. If anyone has seen other interviews with him, thats not how he acts in an interview normily.

I hope that he can get past this and work out his issues and get back to doing comedy. Id hate to see something like this end a career.

AND....not that Im saying it justifies what he did, BUT he wasnt the only person throwing racist remarks around in that video. It seems like its ok for white people to be the targets of racial slurrs in public or on tv and things such as that and no one says much. But when the tables are turned, we all see how fast the media jumps on it especially when its a famous person that is involved.

Ive actually been told to my face by a black person that since I wasnt black, theres no way I could have any idea about or know anything about racism and how it affects people. I was standing with four other guys at the time this was being told to us and two of them happened to be Jewish...Im sure they are just as "clueless" as I am.....

Nicely put...I was getting ready to pretty much say exactly what you said...that's pretty much where I stand on this issue.

MuStAnG12687 · 11-21-2006, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crashsti

i am going to share something here. i had my own experience with racism and it made me take a real hard look at my own character. i had just gotten out of work and its 6am, still dark and very cold. a coworker and i are approached by two visibly intoxicated black men. they claimed to have been walking for quite sometime and were getting cold and wanted to make a phone call to try to get a ride, but needed some change to make the call. i gave the man a few coins and he made his call. a few moments later he came over asking if i could give him a ride. he was very persistant and i was rather annoyed by it. i told him no several times, that i was'nt going in that direction, which i was'nt. he then told me that i would'nt give him a ride because he was black. i was a bit taken back by this. he then told me he was'nt going to steal my car or shoot me and told me i could check him for guns if i wanted to. i finally caved in and gave the guy a ride. i was very agitated at this point and my driving was less then casual. i have a 300horsepower car and i let him know it. the man told me to not be so crazy and to relax. he then told me that he was worried that someone like myself, the white country boy, was going to tie the black man up and leave him in the woods to die. he turned out to be from Philly and was in the area visiting his girlfriend and was OK. he had never been in a small town before that was predominately white. so he was a bit frightened himself. we had a brief conversation and i explained to him that we just don't have any black people in the area. that i did'nt even meet a black person until i was in high school and he was an exchange student from Africa. it was an eye opening experience. it showed my that while i did'nt feel racist, i actually was on the inside whether i liked it or not. part of my upbringing? i can't say, but ever since i have tried to ve very openminded and not simply judge people by the color of the skin.

If people would count others as individuals rather than being associated with certain groups, the world would be much better off...sometimes I catch myself being judgmental because of certain stereotypes--not just race--you then have to think to yourself that we are individuals and you have to judge others as individuals no matter what.

Greenman · 11-21-2006, 10:08 PM

Call me jaded, but I could care less. I still will watch old Seinfeld Reruns and Mad Max movies.

Ryduce · 11-21-2006, 10:24 PM

Not Kramer!!!!

Is there nothing holy left in this world??

MuStAnG12687 · 11-21-2006, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenman

Call me jaded, but I could care less. I still will watch old Seinfeld Reruns and Mad Max movies.

I'm with you on watching reruns of Seinfeld...still the best show ever made IMO.

subgenius · 11-21-2006, 10:57 PM

I think that Richards and the hecklers were in the wrong. The whole two wrongs don't make a right situation. We don't get to see the actual heckling, so we don't know what they said. But, the hecklers DID resort to returning the racist remarks by calling Richards what they called him in the video.

If Richards is a racist, then so were those people that replied to his racism with more racism. The whole situition seemed really ignorant. I doubt that Richards new that a video camera was taping the event.

Also, CBS had that "Apology" removed from You Tube. So, I did not get to see the apology that Richards made on Letterman.

As for what CrashTI said about the guy wanting a ride, I would not give anyone a ride white or black that I did not know. Maybe I am a mean person, but at 6 AM after working all night, I don't give strangers a ride. I might have given him money for a phone call, but even then I may not have done that either.

I was returning to Norfolk from Washington DC with my GF and a few other girls after a Grateful Dead concert at RFK about 12 or 14 years ago. Our car broke down just after we went through Richmond and we were just getting onto I-64. It was like 3 AM. A Mustang pulled up with two tough looking black guys. I was the only guy in my group, and I was scared. I am not afraid to admit that I was afraid. I had three women with me and I did not know what to expect.

Guess what? They were actually very cool dudes. They spoke calmly and were very friendly. I was still distrustful, and I think maybe they sensed it. They asked what was wrong. I told them I thought my car needed a jump start. They hooked up their car to mine, jump started it, and waited around to be sure it ran well enough.

While we waited, we talked for about ten minutes. They were Redskins fans, and I'm a Cowboys fan, but they said that they would forgive me for that, LOL. It turns out that they lived in Portsmouth, VA. So, when we started driving back toward Hampton Roads, they followed us all the way to I-264 and then we parted ways.

You just never know what to expect. There are good and bad people in every race, creed, ethnicity, and gender...

MuStAnG12687 · 11-21-2006, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by subgenius

Also, CBS had that "Apology" removed from You Tube. So, I did not get to see the apology that Richards made on Letterman.

I would normally watch Leno over Letterman any day of the week(Conan above all

), but on Monday I knew Jerry Seinfeld was going to be a guest so I decided to watch...I haven't even heard of the Michael Richards incident and then Jerry says that Michael wanted to talk and they cut to him speaking in California. To sum it up he looked terrible first off. He was deeply regretful and sorry for what he done...he was on for about 5-8 mins talking and it was delivered sincere...they might show segment on the news once in a while but if you get the chance to see the whole 5-8 mins uninterrupted you'd probably come to a similar conclusion. Michael didn't seem himself and he looked like he had a nervous breakdown or something to that affect.

Ryduce · 11-21-2006, 11:38 PM

Yeh he looked bad.It was pretty rough to watch,especially when he referred to them as "Afro Americans"and the audience burst out laughing.It was like watching a train wreck.Jerry did stand up for him though,and that was pretty decent of Jerry.Kramer is still the best character on television,and I feel kind of sorry for him.His career will probably never be the same.

But on a side note,he refrenced Jiu-Jitsu in his apology,which is pretty cool.

angryjonny · 11-21-2006, 11:43 PM

I didn't get why they thought "afro americans" was funny. Or why they thought anything he was going to say would be funny in his apology.

MuStAnG12687 · 11-21-2006, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angryjonny

I didn't get why they thought "afro americans" was funny. Or why they thought anything he was going to say would be funny in his apology.

I think the crowed laughed first of all because most of them probably didn't know what happened and secondly we only know Michael Richards as a funny man...the serious side to him was peculiar to most...I think people laughed to test him out--they didn't know if he was totally serious or not because they were unaware of the situation...