the preach man

guys, think about it like this. If it's a foul to throw in the towel...then a fighter would be DQ'ed for his corner throwing in the towel (that would give the other figher the win). The rules dont arnt saying that a corner cannot thrown in the towel, just that if they throw in the towel that it will cost there fighter the fight (which is the purpose of throwing in the towel).

It's in the rules like that to make it official.

angryjonny

That and another situation where lots of people thought it was so cool that he did this and no one has said too much negative about it so I'll take the heat but I thought Gurgel telling Rich to keep punching and that his hand is no big deal or whatever he said was ridiculous.

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dagenhamdave

I think it's a foul because as stated earlier, money is riding on these fights. UFC is headquarted in Vegas. People bet on fights. People bet very specifically on fights as in winner by TKO/KO, Rd. 2. There is no option for Towel thrown in 3rd. So if you bet TKO/KO in the 3rd and before Big John stops it, the corner throws in the towel, the guy betting does not win and house can not win.

Fight betting is big business so the UFC chooses to put the burden on the Ref or the Dr. to stop the fight only.

j87gtmd

Im still unclear about this?

the preach man

I hear what you are saying but it doesnt make any sense. How can the ref deny a forfiet from the corner? It's as simple as this, "IT's a foul to throw in the towell, therefore....if you throw in the towel you lose the fight. You guys are reading more into this than you should.

angryjonny

Right. I think the thought processes here are working on overdrive when they don't need to. Yes a corner can throw in the towel. One of the ways to win is forfeit. Throwing in a towel is forfeiting the fight. The ref isn't going to keep letting the fight go on if a towel is thrown in.

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dagenhamdave

I'm still not sure since you can't bet on a forfeit or a DQ. It's the same reasons draws don't exsist anymore. You can't bet a draw.

angryjonny

So do you think that if a corner wants to stop the fight, they throw in the towel, the ref is going to throw it back out of the ring and make him keep fighting? If betting is a priority over fighter safety I will stop supporting any organization that supports that theory. Some people may think that ref's are perfect but watch Sims vs. Gracie I to see numerous fouls and Sims nearly get his neck broken to see how good the ref was at protecting them.

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sitnspin

I think it's the same as a DQ, which is a win for the other guy, so betting is unaffected. Right?

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Krakatau

Preach man has it. It is just putting language into the rules to make towel throwing official. I don't know what all this crap about betting is, but it sounds bogus to me. As Angryjohnny said, any organization putting betting ahead of the atheletes safety isn't worth its salt.

tonster

I'm glad rich didn't hurt himself so much that he can't fight anymore. thank you adrenaline!

mepersoner

It's a foul to throw in the towel because if you throw in the towel you lose the fight. Just like if you're caught intentially eye gouging or something, it's a foul, you lose.

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dagenhamdave

You are completely missing the point. This has nothing to do with fighter safety and I never said Big John would throw the towel out. Look at this list of fouls.

Fouls: [Top]
1. Butting with the head.
2. Eye gouging of any kind.
3. Biting.
4. Hair pulling.
5. Fish hooking.
6. Groin attacks of any kind.
7. Putting a finger into any orifice or into any cut or laceration on an opponent.
8. Small joint manipulation.
9. Striking to the spine or the back of the head.
10. Striking downward using the point of the elbow.
11. Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea.
12. Clawing, pinching or twisting the flesh.
13. Grabbing the clavicle.
14. Kicking the head of a grounded opponent.
15. Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent.
16. Stomping a grounded opponent.
17. Kicking to the kidney with the heel.
18. Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck.
19. Throwing an opponent out of the ring or fenced area.
20. Holding the shorts or gloves of an opponent.
21. Spitting at an opponent.
22. Engaging in an unsportsmanlike conduct that causes an injury to an opponent.
23. Holding the ropes or the fence.
24. Using abusive language in the ring or fenced area.
25. Attacking an opponent on or during the break.
26. Attacking an opponent who is under the care of the referee.
27. Attacking an opponent after the bell has sounded the end of the period of unarmed combat.
28. Flagrantly disregarding the instructions of the referee.
29. Timidity, including, without limitation, avoiding contact with an opponent, intentionally or consistently dropping the mouthpiece or faking an injury.
30. Interference by the corner.
31. Throwing in the towel during competition.

And the ways to win:
Ways To Win: [Top]
1. Submission by:
Physical tap out.
Verbal tap out.
2. Technical knockout by the referee stopping the contest.
3. Decision via the scorecards, including:
Unanimous decision.
Split decision.
Majority decision.
Draw, including:
Unanimous draw.
Majority draw.
Split draw.
4. Technical decision.
5. Technical draw.
6. Disqualification.
7. Forfeit.
8. No contest.

Sorry for the long post but I see "towel thrown" in fouls but not in ways to win. I also see "fence grabbing" as a foul. So Silva must have beaten Sylvia I guess. And I also see "using abusive language" so Nick Diaz lost all his fights due to foul? No you don't see a loss resulting from a foul automatically as a lot of you seem to be saying here. The point I'm making is the business of Vegas is betting and if an organization can limit the losses of the casinos in such a way as to not put their fighters in harms way, what motivation would they have not to do it? It is fight business afterall. If you think it has nothing to do with it, please explain to me when the last draw occured in the UFC. Also when was the last time the towel was thrown in? I just named several other very recent fouls that did not effect the outcome of the fight.

angryjonny

I'm really not missing the point. If the option for the corner to not throw the towel in isn't there that is one less safety precaution that is there. Thankfully it is not that way.

Also as if I even need to explain this, but maybe I do. One foul does not automatically DQ a fighter. And a towel being thrown in is not a DQ. And it has been a long time since a towel has been thrown in. You know what that means? The refs are doing their jobs well. If I was cornering a fighter and he was getting beatdown bad and I saw the fighter was in danger but the ref didn't you can bet I'd be throwing the towel in.

Like I said before if UFC is favoring betting over fighter saftey screw them. But they aren't so that doesn't matter. Besides all you are saying would go against all the bs reasons that Dana gave for getting rid of Lindland.

It's an interesting concept but a little off.

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Thrash13

It's really simple like jonny said. The refs are doing their jobs.

If we ever get to a time where towels have to be thrown in, you can kiss the network TV deals goodbye. We will be watching only on PPV again.