UFC Rankings beginning 2007 - Fight Forum - MMA - UFC - Boxing - K1

mepersoner · 02-02-2007, 03:13 AM

The base procedure for these rankings comes from here. I already asked the creator if it was okay that I did something similar, and he agreed. That said, here are my initial rules for these rankings (these are up for discussion, so please, discuss):

Winning

If a lower rank fighter beats a higher ranked fighter, he takes that fighter's rank.
If a lower ranked fighter beats a higher ranked fighter by disqualification, then the fighter does not take the higher ranked fighter's rank.

Losing

If a fighter loses, his rank goes down depending on the circumstances of the loss.
If a lower ranked fighter loses to a higher ranked fighter, the fighter's rank goes down by 1. A loss should always be penalized in ranking.
If a fighter loses by disqualification, he loses 5 ranks regardless of whether or not the fighter was the higher or lower ranked fighter.
If a higher ranked fighter loses to a lower ranked fighter, his rank will drop according to the decisiveness of the loss.
A majority or split decision loss drops the fighter 2 ranks.
A unanimous decision loss drops the fighter 3 ranks.
A loss due to cut drops the fighter's rank 4 ranks.
A loss due to any other type of TKO or Submission drops the fighter 5 ranks.

Draw

The higher ranked fighter's rank is unaffected by a draw.
The lower ranked fighter's rank may go up due to a draw. This is determined by the average of the two fighters' ranks, and rounded down. If a rank #20 fighter ties the rank #1 figher, then the fighter becomes rank #11.

Sliding

Ranking can change due to other fights.
For example, there is a rank #5 fighter. The rank #1 and rank #2 figher fight, and the rank #2 figher wins by KO. The rank #1 fighter drops to rank #6, and the rank #5 fighter becomes ranked #4.
It could work the opposite, if there is a rank #8 fighter, and the rank #10 fighter beats the rank #1 fighter by KO, the rank #10 becomes #1, the #1 becomes #6, and the #8 becomes #9.

Inactivity

If a fighter does not fight during a calendar year, he forfeits ranking.

Vacancy

If there is no #1 ranked fighter due to inactivity or disqualification, then the #1 spot will be determined by the #2 ranked fighter's next fight, with the winner becoming #1.

Tournaments

The first round a tournament the rankings are done just as in any other fight.
If it is the second fight (or more) in a night due to a tournament, a fighter cannot lose more than 3 ranks.

Organizations

Rankings are done per organization. There will be UFC rankings, Pride rankings, K-1 Hero rankings, and IFL rankings.

More following...

mepersoner · 02-02-2007, 03:33 AM

Okay, before posting the starting rankings of the year, I'd like to just take a moment to discuss how much the initial rankings are going to suck. Basically, I'm starting with the year 2007. Fights and rankings before that don't count, at least not here. While these will make the rankings poor at first, as time goes on and more fights are added and people who are actually ranked start fighting each other, it will smooth over. So don't worry too much about these initial rankings, maybe just discuss the method used to get them.

Also, if it's a fighter's first fight in the organization since the start of 2007, the fighters start off in last. Since there are no rankings to start, this first UFN has many of the fighters starting off in second place and vying for the first place spot. Rankings are determined before the UFN and then afterwards, not before each individual fight. So 185 looked like this beforehand:

Rank #2
Ed Herman
Chris Price
Nathan Marquardt
Dean Lister

because there are no rankings yet, but they all start off in last (which is #2) and rank #1 is not given out by default. However, after the event was over, the rankings looked like this:

Rank #2
Ed Herman/Nathan Marquardt (they're tied for 1st/second due to both winning and both being ranked #2 beforehand, I think I will default Herman the spot because he fought first, getting the vacant #1 spot. Opinion says give it to Marquardt, but this is to be an objective ranking)
Rank #5 Dean Lister (loss of 3 places from #2 to #5 due to decision loss)
Rank #7 Chris Price. (loss of 5 places from #2 to #7 due to submission loss).

However, there are no fighters ranked #3, #4, or #6. So post the event the rankings will be as follows:

Rank #2
Ed Herman/Nathan Marquardt
Rank #3
Dean Lister
Rank #4
Chris Price

That said, here are the rankings:

Heavyweights

Jake O' Brien Opponents: Heath Herring (W-D)
Heath Herring Opponents: Jake O'Brien (L-D)

Light Heavyweights

Rashad Evans Opponents: Sean Salmon (W-KO)
Sean Salmon Opponents: Rashad Evans (L-KO)

Middleweights

Ed Herman Opponents: Chris Price (W-S)
Nathan Marquardt Opponents: Dean Lister (W-D)
Dean Lister Opponents: Nathan Marquardt (L-D)
Chris Price Opponents: Ed Herman (L-S)

Welterweights

Rich Clementi Opponents: Ross Pointon (W-S)
Josh Burkman Opponents: Chad Reiner (W-D)
Chad Reiner Opponents: Josh Burkman (L-D)
Ross Pointon Opponents: Rich Clementi (L-S)

Lightweights

Din Thomas Opponents: Clay Guida (W-D)
Hermes Franca Opponents: Spencer Fisher (W-KO)
Clay Guida Opponents: Din Thomas (L-D)
Spencer Fisher Opponents: Hermes Franca (L-KO)

JoeRoganismyhero · 02-02-2007, 06:36 AM

I like the ranking system except a fighter should not fall 4 ranks because of a cut. If you happen to be facing Kenny "Lucky Elbow" Florian 1 lucky slice and you drop from say 6th to 10th!

mepersoner · 02-02-2007, 06:53 AM

Yeah, I understand where you're coming from, which is why I made it less than a normal TKO or submission. There are a lot more lucky cuts. There are however, cuts that deserve to stop a fight.

sitnspin · 02-02-2007, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeRoganismyhero

I like the ranking system except a fighter should not fall 4 ranks because of a cut. If you happen to be facing Kenny "Lucky Elbow" Florian 1 lucky slice and you drop from say 6th to 10th!

I couldn't agree more. Cuts can basically be a freak accident that have no relation to the way the actual fight went. At most I could see a stoppage via cut to take you down one peg.

mepersoner · 02-04-2007, 11:32 PM

New Rankings as of last night. Still pretty bad, but at least the lists are starting to fill out now.

Heavyweights

Jake O' Brien Opponents: Heath Herring (W-D)
Heath Herring Opponents: Jake O'Brien (L-D)
Mirko Filipovic Opponents: Eddie Sanchez (W-KO)
Eddie Sanchez Opponents: Mirko Filipovic (L-KO)

Light Heavyweights

Rashad Evans Opponents: Sean Salmon (W-KO)
Sean Salmon Opponents: Rashad Evans (L-KO)
Ryoto Machida Opponents: Sam Hoger (W-D)
Quinton Jackson Opponents: Marvin Eastman (W-KO)
Sam Hoger Opponents: Ryoto Machida (L-D)
Marvin Eastman Opponents: Quinton Jackson (L-KO)

Middleweights

Ed Herman Opponents: Chris Price (W-S)
Nathan Marquardt Opponents: Dean Lister (W-D)
Dean Lister Opponents: Nathan Marquardt (L-D)
Chris Price Opponents: Ed Herman (L-S)
Terry Martin Opponents: Jorge Rivera (W-KO)
Patrick Cote Opponents: Scott Smith (W-D)
Anderson Silva Opponents: Travis Lutter (W-KO)
Scott Smith Opponents: Patrick Cote (L-D)
Jorge Rivera Opponents: Terry Martin (L-KO)
Travis Lutter Opponents: Anderson Silva (L-KO)

Welterweights

Rich Clementi Opponents: Ross Pointon (W-S)
Josh Burkman Opponents: Chad Reiner (W-D)
Chad Reiner Opponents: Josh Burkman (L-D)
Ross Pointon Opponents: Rich Clementi (L-S)

Lightweights

Din Thomas Opponents: Clay Guida (W-D)
Hermes Franca Opponents: Spencer Fisher (W-KO)
Clay Guida Opponents: Din Thomas (L-D)
Spencer Fisher Opponents: Hermes Franca (L-KO)
Dustin Hazelett Opponents: Diego Saraiva (W-D)
Frank Edgar Opponents: Tyson Griffin (W-D)
Roger Huerta Opponents: John Halverson (W-KO)
Diego Saraiva Opponents: Dustin Hazelett (L-D)
Tyson Griffin Opponents: Frank Edgar (L-D)
John Halverson Roger Huerta (L-KO)

Aspec · 02-05-2007, 10:53 AM

Not your fault, but these are horrible.

For example, decisioning Lister is a greater accomplishment than submitting Price.
Then you have Mirko who won by KO, ranked behind a guy that got beat up all fight long, Herring.

Sean Salmon ranked second? LoL!

Harms · 02-05-2007, 11:01 AM

I understand the whole they haven't fought yet this year aspect, but I think you should make an exception with the org. champs. They should always be ranked #1. Being the champ should trump the ranking system since they are the obvious #1 ranked fighter in that paticular weight class. That being said, Silva should be ranked #1 instead of #7. Just a suggestion.

jm1010 · 02-05-2007, 11:04 AM

This could take waaaayyy too long to fill out. I think you should consider the last six months of 2006.

Shoney · 02-05-2007, 12:59 PM

I agree with Aspec 100%.

SeikanJudanski · 02-05-2007, 02:10 PM

What on earth was the person thinking making this rule,

"For example, there is a rank #5 fighter. The rank #1 and rank #2 figher fight, and the rank #2 figher wins by KO. The rank #1 fighter drops to rank #6, and the rank #5 fighter becomes ranked #4."

champion2k7 · 02-05-2007, 02:14 PM

Kinda sketchy

Rocky12233 · 02-05-2007, 02:51 PM

Ummmmm......

mepersoner · 02-26-2007, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeikanJudanski

What on earth was the person thinking making this rule,

"For example, there is a rank #5 fighter. The rank #1 and rank #2 figher fight, and the rank #2 figher wins by KO. The rank #1 fighter drops to rank #6, and the rank #5 fighter becomes ranked #4."

The drop 5 ranks rule? Look at it this way. The #1 and #2 guy fight, the #1 guy loses and drops to 6th. He then fights the #7 guy, and loses again. That'd drop him to rank #11th. Two losses in a row to top 10 guys makes it seem that maybe, that although that person is really good, maybe not quite top 10 material. This is also helps weed out people who get fluke wins. For example, little nog just got beat down by a no rank fighter - he should obviously drop quite a few spaces, in this case 5 as per the rules. That fighter (I'm not going to bother trying to find his name so I can spell it) would've then taken Nog's rank in Pride at 205 (definitely top 5). However, is that fighter really top 10 material, or was that a fluke? Well, if it wasn't a fluke, he'll keep winning, and he won't lose rank or his rank will go up. If it was a fluke and he loses a few, he'll be out of the top 10 where he doesn't belong anyways (not saying either way about this guy, but it's just one possible example).

Yeah, I know the rankings are terrible. Whoever said I should probably go halfway through 2006 and come forward is right, I should actually probably go back to 1993 and come forward, but they'll come along with time. I think in about a year they'll be pretty accurate for the UFC (maybe not so much for Pride though, who holds far less events).

I was doing the IFL too, but meh. I'm not interested enough to keep that going.

mepersoner · 02-26-2007, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aspec

Not your fault, but these are horrible.

For example, decisioning Lister is a greater accomplishment than submitting Price.
Then you have Mirko who won by KO, ranked behind a guy that got beat up all fight long, Herring.

Sean Salmon ranked second? LoL!

If it really is a great accomplishment, it'll show in the future when Lister builds himself back up and when Price drops down. Judging fighters by one fight (which these initial rankings are basically doing) is not a good way to judge. It'll change with time as more fights paints a more accurate picture.

Edit: Nevermind. Yeah, I'm sure Mirko will continue to win and hold rank or go higher, while we'll see about Herring.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harms

I understand the whole they haven't fought yet this year aspect, but I think you should make an exception with the org. champs. They should always be ranked #1. Being the champ should trump the ranking system since they are the obvious #1 ranked fighter in that paticular weight class. That being said, Silva should be ranked #1 instead of #7. Just a suggestion.

Gomi. 'Nuff said.

champion2k7 · 02-26-2007, 03:59 PM

Welterweight
1. St. Pierre, Georges 7-1

2. Sanchez, Diego 6-0

3. Hughes, Matt 14-3

4. Parisyan, Karo 6-2

5. Fitch, Jon 4-0

6. Koscheck, Josh 6-1

7. Burkman, Josh 4-1

8. Serra, Matt 5-4

9. Alves, Thiago 4-2

10. Davis, Marcus 2-1

My personal rankings that decide rank by wins, who they beat and streaks.

duke09 · 02-26-2007, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mepersoner

[*]If a lower rank fighter beats a higher ranked fighter, he takes that fighter's rank.

okay, so if a no namer that has lost to every other ranked fighter gets set up as a can against the champ, and manages to get a lucky punch, he becomes #1?

i know it sounds far fetched, but a guy could potentially have a 1-999 win loss record, but so long as that 1 win comes from beating the champ or the #1 fighter, he gets to be #1? kinda sketchy bud.

i appreciate your efforts in trying to set this up though. good on ya for undertaking such an enterprise.

mepersoner · 02-26-2007, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duke09

okay, so if a no namer that has lost to every other ranked fighter gets set up as a can against the champ, and manages to get a lucky punch, he becomes #1?

i know it sounds far fetched, but a guy could potentially have a 1-999 win loss record, but so long as that 1 win comes from beating the champ or the #1 fighter, he gets to be #1? kinda sketchy bud.

i appreciate your efforts in trying to set this up though. good on ya for undertaking such an enterprise.

That's right, but he won't stay there long unless he keeps winning. Plus, you *don't* really know do you? For example, say tomorrow I have my first MMA fight. I've had a little training here and there, but nothing serious. I lose. I then join a gym, again, and start training semi-regularly and fighting just for the money, not taking it seriously. Over about 2 years I amass a record of about 5 - 12. In my last fight, the guy was a contender, and somehow I managed to do well, but lost. Realizing I may have potential, I start training very seriously and take a break. About 6 months later I fight a rising star, and win. It's looked at as a fluke by most people, and in another 9 months I have a fight against a top 10 guy, basically being fed to him as a can. The angle being that I beat the last guy to beat him (the rising star). I beat this guy. Now my record is 7 - 12. I fight again against a top contender, and again, and again, and again. I'm 11 - 12 and my last four fights were against top contenders... where do rank? Pretty damn high I would think, even with a crappy record.

However, let's say I beat that guy by a fluke punch. Then I lose my next fight, and my next one, and my next one. I was a blip on the radar and now I'm gone. A great example of someone like this is Buster Douglas in boxing. Maybe not a fluke, but he was #1 in the world after he beat Tyson, love it or hate it. However, he didn't really have what it took to be there, and quickly lost it afterwards.

duke09 · 02-26-2007, 04:44 PM

i get that part, but in my example i chose 1-99 for a reason. so, what if our hero beats liddell, becomes #1, and then loses to another can who is 1-98, meanwhile other guys are going 20-0 or 25-0 but the two consecutive #1s have combined records of 2-197, but for whatever reason, the ufc doesnt make teh most logical matchup ( a stretch, i know). you could a guy who is 30-0 who has beaten everyone except for the rotating #1s as they all keep getting ktfo too fast? is this really indicative of #1?

you picking up what im laying down?? tried to make sense but really very ill. thanks bud.

GSPALLTHEWAY · 02-26-2007, 04:59 PM

why not just make your own rankings based on who is best, how they have been doing, and their skill... these rankings are ridiculous and ONLY based on wins and losses... so what if you fight nobodys all year? your #1?